Saruman=Hitler!
No, really. Behold the next Godwin.
(Via Lilac Rose.)
Update: I quite passed over this remark: “If the methods of victims do not differ from that of their attackers, who is to say who the victims now are?” I don’t get it. You want they should have stroked him to death with silk whips instead? What the hell kind of reasoning is that – “He used guns so you can’t use guns to fight him back you have to use lead-weighted nets instead!” One of the dangers of indulging in sanctimony is the way it clouds one’s thought processes. Remember that next time you lecture, mes amis pieux. (Brought to my attention by Mac Swift.)
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LOL, I love ya already! In a completely nonsexual way of course.
Comment by Mac Swift — 3/24/2004 @ 4:39 am
“If the methods of victims do not differ from that of their attackers, who is to say who the victims now are?”
Oh criminy. Now we\’ve got something equally vacuous and obtuse to accompany \"An eye for an eye leaves the world blind\” and \"Peace cannot be maintained by force, it can only be attained by understanding\” on the back of people\’s volvos.
Comment by Russell — 3/24/2004 @ 4:56 am
There is all the difference in the world between killing your enemy when trying to capture them (eg Sadaam\’s sons), and using a helicopter gunship to take out someone who may not even have had guards with him.
I am just so glad that the Americans didnt do what the whole world expected them to do and blast Sadaam out of the ground when they found him.
Justice is best served by capturing criminals and trying them. I know a life in prison seems to many too weak a punishment, but I am sure many would prefer to die than experience that.
I am not \’weak\’, but I draw the line and condoning this kind of violence without even an attempt at capture.
Comment by Adrian Warnock\’s UK Blog — 3/24/2004 @ 5:58 am
\"There is all the difference in the world between killing your enemy when trying to capture them (eg Sadaam?s sons), and using a helicopter gunship to take out someone who may not even have had guards with him.\”
So – it would have been okay if he had had \"guards\” with him, therefore killing more people?
\"I am just so glad that the Americans didnt do what the whole world expected them to do and blast Sadaam out of the ground when they found him.\”
Why? This is a non-sequitur, by the way; the subject was not Saddam Hussein but this Sheik Yassin bloke. But thanks for at least not being pissed off that we captured Hussein instead of letting him go with a stern warning and a bag of candy, unlike many of your compatriots.
\"Justice is best served by capturing criminals and trying them. I know a life in prison seems to many too weak a punishment, but I am sure many would prefer to die than experience that.\”
That\’s nice, but we aren\’t talking about Tony Soprano or his real-world equivalent, but someone whose power came from his ability to inspire his followers to undertake such unnatural activity as suicide bombings of school buses. Say what you like about the average criminal, but at least the bulk of them still have their self-preservation instincts intact, and are thus amenable to such minimal societal controls as the threat of prison. Religious fanatics can\’t be controlled like this. Yassin in prison would have been just as much of a troublemaker as Yassin out of prison: he would have inspired the same sort of behavior in his followers. Worse, he would have been a bargaining chip for the Palestinian terrorist\’s second favorite activity: capturing people and holding them hostage until the Israeli government agreed to let certain persons out of jail. Unfortunately they have fallen for this ploy before. Yassin is much less of a problem dead; what are his followers going to do, get even \"angrier\” and blow up more stuff? As if they didn\’t do such on a regular basis.
Perhaps you are confused by all the talk of \"martyrdom\” that these terrorists engage in and that is why you indulge in this naive moral equivalency. But if you would study the matter I think you will find that the Christian idea of martyrdom and the Muslim\’s, at least the modern one, are two very different concepts. That\’s the only excuse I\’ll permit you for your blinkered stupidity.
Comment by Andrea Harris — 3/24/2004 @ 9:56 am
So – it would have been okay if he had had “guards” with him, therefore killing more people?
He did have guards with him, but none of them were missle proof.
Adrian: As for Saddam\’s capture, the only reason he didn\’t get smeared all over the inside of his spider hole was that he jumped out with his hands up the instant they opened the cover. The standard procedure to clear out a hole like that is to drop a grenade in, and the soldiers were about to do just that but fear lent the old dictator wings.
Comment by Sortelli — 3/24/2004 @ 10:34 am
For the record, I find the death of scumbags like this entirely funny and entirely enjoyable.
But then, I think there\’s something sociopathic and downright dangerous about people who cannot make themselves feel hatred, or take joy in the destruction of evil human beings. I\’m weird that way. I like seeing evil destroyed. A lot.
Comment by Dean Esmay — 3/24/2004 @ 12:52 pm
The Sheikh, continued
The death of Sheikh Yassin has spurred a surprising amount of discussion across the Blogosphere. Some bloggers felt that the
Trackback by Joshua Claybourn\’s Domain — 3/24/2004 @ 1:41 pm
The \"methods\” in question being what, exactly? Explosives? Missiles? Bomb vests used on buses full of civilian men, women, and children, maybe?
Notify me when the IDF starts issuing bomb vests and Palestinian bus-route maps to its soldiers. Until then, please put your pastry intake orifice in its upright and latched position. Thank you.
Comment by Robin Goodfellow — 3/24/2004 @ 9:40 pm
Adrian..most likely, the only way to \’capture\’ him would have been to land a squad (or more) of Israeli commandos, grab him, and somehow get him out again. It is quite likely that several of these troops would have been killed in the process. Does this factor into your equation? And how about the significant number of civilians who might have been killed in the ensuing firefight?
Comment by david foster — 3/24/2004 @ 9:52 pm
And also, Adrian, how do you feel about the Special Operations Executive plan (\"operation Foxley\") to kill Hitler? (unfortunately never executed). Note that the operative verb is \"kill,\” not \"capture.\” Is this also something you would \"draw the line\” at? If not, wherein lies the difference?
Comment by david foster — 3/24/2004 @ 9:54 pm
But then, I think there’s something sociopathic and downright dangerous about people who cannot make themselves feel hatred, or take joy in the destruction of evil human beings. I’m weird that way. I like seeing evil destroyed. A lot.
Dean, I am totally in agreement. If you disconnect your ability to hate something wicked, you\’ve lost your ability to love what is good.
Comment by Sortelli — 3/25/2004 @ 4:14 am
Dean & Sortelli – well stated! I noticed that the fallout is continuing in the pacifist-leaning side of the Christian blogosphere. I just wish these folks would spend more time getting upset over real evil (like Hamas, for example) rather than at what somebody posted on his blog. But I guess I expect too much…
Comment by susan b. — 3/25/2004 @ 3:15 pm
Some final words on that Yassin business…
Adrian Warnock says that \"murder isn\’t right\". This is true, of course. But was the Yassin assassination murder? The way…
Trackback by LilacRose — 3/25/2004 @ 3:38 pm
I not only applaud blowing away Yassin but as far as I\’m concerned the Izzies should have unloaded napalm cannisters on the funeral.
Comment by Peter — 3/25/2004 @ 7:34 pm